0022 Thrive and Connect: Majors Jungian Assessments: Foundations – Part 1

For more on the Majors PT Elements and PT Inventory go to www.aureliuspress.com/assessments.

00:26 Introducing Dr. Mark Majors, PhD. Today were talking with the Jungian psychologist Dr. Mark Majors who in addition to being a counselor and therapist is also a psychometrician who has developed several type assessments based on Carl Jung’s work.

Jung

02:29 Origins of the Majors assessments.  Mark discusses the origins of the assessments he created. It started with reading Carl Jung’s work in depth rather than summary statements made by other authors. He emphasizes the importance of chapter 10 in Jung’s seminal book “Psychological Types.” He wanted to add the missing elements back into the Type world. Mark focuses on the fact that in the Introduction Jung states, “I observed…” which means he focused on information that lends itself to the psychometric. This includes Type as well as the mental processes which Mark refers to as the Majors-Jungian mental processes. This led to the creation of questions in marks assessments based on the observable.

06:25 Isabel Myers influence.  Isabel Myers, while not being a psychometrician, was looking for observable evidence to support her work on the mental processes. She settled for the 16 types.

08:07 Theory vs Observable.  Mark shares his thoughts on the significance of theory versus observing patterns. Mark proceeds to discuss Jung’s approach, his own, and the impact on assessments. He references the fact that the title of your’s book is, “Psychological Types,” NOT, “The Theory of Psychological Type.” Rather than theory, Mark’s focus is on quantifying what Jung said regarding each of the eight mental functions.

This is contrasted with the static model of dominant, auxiliary, tertiary, etc.

Jung felt that individuals are very dynamic and that they can change how they work with their mental functions as they go through life. Could be healthy or could be unhealthy but the reality remains that people are flexible in how they choose to go through life.

14:15 Majors-Jungian Processes Real Time Assessment.  In light of this, Mark felt he had to come up with a more real-time measurement of the eight processes in addition to the components of the static model, i.e., the four dichotomous types, e.g., ENFP.

The value of using the eight Majors-Jungian process scores to evaluate a person’s progress over time is emphasized.

16:24 Therapy: Whole Type, personality formation, 8 Majors-Jungian Processes (MJP)-real time.  The conversation shifts to the realities of therapeutic sessions where it’s potentially more advantageous to start with personality formation which is the second part of the Majors PT Elements. Mark developed the personality formation portion of the assessment directly from his understanding of Jung’s intentions.

Marks application of personality formation has two components, perseverance, where the individual indicates how much they rely on self, and adaptation which shows the extent to which the individual relates to other people. He goes on to explain how the scores in this particular area of the Majors PT Elements help the therapist to determine questions that can be asked of the individual as to how they have chosen to walk through life in both dealing with themselves and with others.

23:07 Therapy: Direct connection. The therapist can make a direct connection using the personality formation scores.

23:54 Therapy: Theoretical punishment.  The term “Theoretical Punishment” is described along with the need to simply listen to the individuals story as to how they have adapted rather than project the consequences of a given model.

The goal is to find a way to help them improve the way they respond to and adapt to life to help them feel better rather than to pull the rug out from under them and “take them to the woodshed.”

So, starting with the story via the personality formation scores without any theory in the way will help the client find their path. That is what is behind the development of the Majors assessments.

26:24 Therapy: Static models.  With only the static model all we can do is look and guess. This is where theories are at risk for going astray.

29:17 The Importance of Psychometrics and Observable Reality. Consequently, the psychometric portion of question development is very important so that a valid connection is made with the individual in order accurately measure what can be observed.

In line with this he talks about the development of the majors PTI back in 2001 including the alpha coefficients and validity along with the search for best fit.

The key point is the assessments are based on fit with observational reality first and the psychometrics second in contrast to a lot of other assessments were the primary focus is psychometrics.

32:56 Psychometric Arrogance and Error. Psychometric arrogance and psychometric error can occur when the focus is on a best-fit psychometric approach at the end of a workshop rather than sitting with the individual as a first step to insure there is a genuine connection with the assessments results.

An example is given of the real life, flesh-and-blood common reality that is at the core we are trying to get to when using assessments. The psychometrician is saddled with trying to quantify these very human experiences and putting a label on it. One must tread very lightly and carefully.

During training sessions Mark encourages attendees to focus on and push the storytelling rather than getting caught up in the assessment itself.

In developing the PTI and PTE Mark always had in mind using the assessments to get to the story.

Working in this manner puts humanity into the instruments.

41:00  Assessment As Story Guide.  The personality formation scores than the eight Majors-Jungian process scores will give a good “read” on what is going on in the person’s life today separate from what their static Type is.

A specific example of how this works is given.

45:20 Development of the 8 MJP Process Scores.  The discussion moved on to the development of the eight Majors-Jungian process scores. It took Mark a decade to develop the eight process course. He explains the “frontier” work that was required. It all comes back to getting the story.

49:07 Real World Application of 8 MJPs. Mark talks about the real world application of the results of using his assessments with the 8 Majors-Jungian Process scores to help people, for example, improve their performance at work.

51:07 Uniqueness of 8 MJP. Mark points out that only his assessments measure the eight Majors-Jungian processes directly. Application in therapeutic sessions as well as during life coaching events is discussed. This includes being able to re-administer the assessment over time to see how the client is progressing, standing still, or falling back.

53:02 Intentionality, Use of Assessments, and The Guru Trap. An emphasis is placed on avoiding getting caught up in the tool in any theory associated with it. It’s all about making a connection. It’s about helping the person with what they want help with rather than pushing the assessor’s agenda. The potential trap of a “guru philosophy” and the harm that can cause is explained.

The purpose of the tool (assessment)  is only to help the client gain a better understanding of himself in order to decide what to do. This is in contrast to the clinician deciding what is best for the client. Rather, the clinician/life coach/change manager can work to help the client discover what needs to be seen rather than forcing it upon them.

What can work better is more of a Rogerian approach where the client innately has a sense of what’s best for them and the assessor’s job is to help bring that to the conscious mind to be worked with.

A humorous example is given of an “I’m the boss and know what’s best” approach that was frustrating and wasted a lot of energy. It is better to have humility, empathy, and understanding to encourage the individual to move in a direction that is in their best interest.

1:01:28 Pop Psychology and Free Assessment.  The challenges of pop-psych “assessments” are discussed and compared to the validated results one can get with the Majors assessments.

For more on the Majors PT Elements and PT Inventory go to www.aureliuspress.com/assessments.

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0021 Thrive and Connect: Suicide Survivors – Josh Rivedal

National Suicide Prevention Life Line 1-800-273-TALK, that’s 1-800-273-8255.

In the Dallas – Ft. Worth area you can get help at  Mental Health of America of Greater Tarrant County. www.mhatc.org

LOSSTeam information can be gotten at www.lossteam.comhope-candle-hands11205410_s

We enter our conversation with Josh talking about how people want to avoid the topic of suicide like the plague. He had lost his paternal grandfather and then his father to suicide and no one was allowed to talk about it in the house. Knowledge of the facts would have helped Josh avoid his suicidal crisis.

He discusses the sense of shame that his father had in not wanting to talk about his grandfather’s suicide and how his father took his life on the day his divorce from Josh’s mother was to be finalized. In turn, as with other survivors, this increased the odds of Josh considering and completing suicide.

After his father completed suicide Josh worked to grow his own career and move forward.  IN 2009 – 2010 he created a one-man show, Kicking My Blue Jeans In the Butt, centered on his relationship with his father.

During this time Josh was going through a difficult time with his mother who was suing him with regards to his father’s estate.

He used work to avoid his problems. Slowly he slid into clinical depression. This led to him considering suicide. While in crisis he risked calling his mother. She intuitively had the courage to ask him if he was considering suicide, something that most people are afraid to do because they fear it will encourage the person to do it. She encouraged and helped him to find professional help.

Josh’s recovery process led him to the decision to speak out. He re-framed his one-man show and re-introduced it in 2011, adding educational portions as well as Q&A sessions.

Josh shares the impact the interaction with the audience has had on himself as well as attendees of the show. He now speaks between 35-40 times a year to survival groups, colleges and high schools, and juvenile detention centers.

He is now working with venture capital firms and entrepreneurs on learning how to reframe failure along with his work with LOSSTeams and postvention. He has explored the field of human capital management.

The difficulties associated with exploring grief and the time and effort required for Josh are delineated. This includes his having to “climb in” to his father’s character in his one-man show. It led to empathy and a greater understanding of what his father went through. This helped with his own recovery process.

The interview shifted to the inheritance issue that surfaced after his father completed suicide. Moral honesty vs emotional honesty when someone dies in a power dynamic and the dysfunction comes to the surface is discussed. The importance of seeking help and not isolating in such situations is emphasized.

The pending publication of “Winning the War on Depression and Living Mentally Well” is mentioned along with the currently available “Reengaging With Life, Creating a New You” are mentioned along with information for accessing them. The later book is quite interesting because it has 50 authors who tell their own story and the difficulties they overcame to be more of themselves.  Topics include LGBT, depression, disabilities, and suicide.

This led to talking about the importance of helping others get their story out to the public. It is the beginning of any great movement such as preventing and recovering from suicide.

Josh describes the importance of each of us telling our story and the fact that we don’t have to be a professional writer or actor to do so. Josh also provides direction to at-risk individuals who might be listening to the podcast.

Coming out of the isolation by helping others is advised. It can give purpose to one’s life.

Carl Jung’s approach to recovery – using one’s own wound/pain and  healing process as a source of inspiration to help others is presented. This can be quite helpful for others since there can be stigma and discrimination associated with suicide.

Josh emphasizes for the survivor that getting their story out is for the reader or the listener. This can help with your healing process.

The i’Mpossible Project: Reengaging with Life, Creating a New You — www.iampossibleproject.com/one

Storytelling guidelines for more i’Mpossible stories: www.iampossibleproject.com/guidelines

The Gospel According to Josh http://www.gospeljosh.com/

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0020 Thrive and Connect: Dealing With Violence

Jennifer talks about the stress she is feeling living in Jerusalem right now. People are being routinely attacked on a daily basis making a challenging to maintain an attitude of thriving in connecting.

Sleeplessness, physical difficulties, and irritability have increased yet she finds it important to deal with these feelings in order to remain true to her personal beliefs. All this while there is danger in just walking down the street.violence

The use of mindful practice including breathing exercises and looking for what is beautiful in the environment has provided some benefit.

She talks about feeling extreme fear and the feeling of powerlessness in the sense of being trapped within oneself.

Even while there is plenty of work for her to do in her house there still is that residual sense of feeling trapped. The need to risk getting out and being part of the world in spite of the risks is discussed.

Jennifer shares how her sense of fear is changed from when she was in her 20s and in Belfast, Northern Ireland, in the early 90s as well as other risky areas versus her sense of feeling smaller now that she’s more mature.

Jennifer empathizes with those who have had to live in the state of hypervigilance for any period of time. This includes being in an abusive relationship.

Gary and Jennifer discuss the similarities with those who live for prolonged periods in battle zones.

Jennifer also discusses the challenges associated with not drawing prejudice pictures while at the same time realizing there truly are perpetrators and victims.

Gary and Jennifer discuss how in order to maintain a sense of thriving and connecting humor is an important element. Some examples are provided.

The fact that parents and family worry on both sides of a violent political divide is pointed out. In line with that, efforts to bridge that divide and the associated challenges are presented.

She also talks about her views on the damage caused by religious fundamentalism and extremism regardless of the specific sect. Included with this are the parallel activities associated with racism on both sides of the divide. The danger associated with this can lead to dehumanizing people.

The discussion returns to the challenges of working to thrive and connect in such a situation. This includes dealing with one’s own thoughts of hatred and racism. They can add to the confusion due to self-loathing that can develop on top of this.

Gary discusses with Jennifer the reality that those around us do influence our lives. Consequently the fact that reactive, despicable thoughts arise can be normal. The challenge is in deciding what to do with them. This flows into the need of having loved ones around who can help create a counterbalancing influence. This is very important to Jennifer because professionally and personally she believes in diversity and finding common ground.

One solution is a heart-to-heart connection between individuals rather than some academic activity.

In line with the above Jennifer talks about her own bloodline which includes Arabs, Catholics, Jehovah Witnesses, among other groups.

The significance of the media and the focus that is selected by media outlets is also discussed.

Another element that is brought into focus is the impact of close to home, low-level violence, e.g., small time theft done with impunity.

An irony is mentioned which is Israel is actually a fairly stable and safe place to be outside of disruptive incidences such as the current ones.

The situation is related to those not necessarily in as dramatic a situation but who are, regardless, feeling a sense of isolation.

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0019 Thrive and Connect: Suicide Survivors – LOSSTeam: Amanda Stidam

Amanda Stidam is a LOSSTeam member (www.lossteam.com). She relates her mother’s suicide one day after her 35th birthday, which became a dividing point in her life. She felt alone and didn’t find resources until later. She now dedicates herself to helping make sure there are resources in her county.hope-candle-hands11205410_s

She discusses generational issues with respect to mental illness.

Difficulties communicating with her husband and daughter surfaced over time. A big part of the difficulty was the loss of her mother whom Amanda focused on keeping happy. The death left Amanda having to decide who she would be.

Amanda compartmentalized and became and expert “plate spinner.” She became extremely task-oriented.

Through therapy she learned to like herself and process her mother’s suicide.

When working on the LOSSTeam and making contact with a recent survivor she goes back in time to her mother’s suicide and uses that experience to help the recent survivor.

Amanda shares the tools she uses for herself in helping others to deal with being recent survivors.

Her advice to someone who feels lost right now is this: “You matter!”

Amanda describes how to get a lost one’s name on her marathon running shirt via a Facebook link Suicide Sucks Run.

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0018 Thrive and Connect: Suicide Survivors – LOSSTeam: Winona Barstow

Winona Barstow is a suicide survivor and LOSSTeam member (www.lossteam.com). The LOSSTeam provides comfort and support without giving advice or therapy. It directs the survivor towards resources hope-candle-hands11205410_sthat can help.

Winona was 10 years old when she experienced the loss of her loved one, her mother. She received no counseling and was told to accept it and just move on. The next 10 years were very rough. She looked and acted like her deceased mother, which triggered her primary caregiver, her grandmother.

Her grandmother dies 5 years after her mother. Winona was then forced to live with another relative followed by becoming a ward of the state.

This led to drugs and alcohol plus tumultuous marriages.

Eventually, she attempted suicide herself.

Under the care of an empathetic counselor Winona started transitioning by going back to age 10 and moving forward. It has helped her with her own children and improving her own mental health.

Being on the LOSSTeam has helped her recovery by being able to be present for others.

Winona is pleased with how she has reclaimed her life. Counseling has helped her get the focus off herself and instead help others.

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0017 Thrive and Connect: Suicide Survivors – LOSSTeam: Phyllis Crevison

Phyllis Crevison is a survivor of suicide who talks about the loss of her son and her recovery path that led her to joining the LOSSTeam (http://www.lossteam.com/hope-candle-hands11205410_s).

Phyllis shares the difficulties her son experienced including difficulties i romantic relationships plus education and challenges in the military.

The one big thing she came to realize is even if it is someone you think will never do it, you don’t know how desperate they might be. Fear of death can disappear. They are just looking for a path out of the suffering.

Phyllis talks about the initial shock she felt that seemed like an unrealistic dream pushing her to the edge and the gratitude she has for the compassion shown by the LOSSTeam that showed up after her son completed suicide. Now, as a LOSSTeam member herself she tells of the empathy she can bring to the situation.

Phyllis emphasizes the need to take the loss one day at a time. There can be times that one gets triggered and needs to just take it as it comes.

Building a remembrance scrap book with her son’s friends was hard but healing.

Again, her advice to listeners of this podcast is to take it one day at a time and work through it. It CAN get better.

She emphasizes the importance of respecting the reality that different people have different paths back to health.

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0016 Thrive and Connect: Suicide Survivors – LOSSTeam: Greta Mayer

Greta Mayer chairs the Suicide Prevention Coalition (http://www.mhrb.org/suicide-prevention.aspx) in Clark, Greene, and Madison Counties in Ohio as of Sept, 2014.

She talks about interfacing with suicide survivors and what she, as a professional, has learned from hope-candle-hands11205410_ssurvivors.

In addition to making positive connections, Greta brings up the need to expand LOSSTeams in order to provide more services, especially with regards to survivors understanding other survivors. Clinicians can only go so far.

Also, clinicians and agencies themselves need additional resources in order to build a peer-to-peer connection network for supporting the suicide survivor and all the aspects of their life which is impacted by suicide.

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0015 Thrive and Connect: Suicide Survivors – LOSSTeam – Misconceptions: Dr. David Miers

Dr. David Miers (http://www.bryanhealth.com/) share the misconceptions suicide survivors run into on a routine basis. These misconceptions stigmatize survivors to the extent they will choose to stay quiet and withdraw. This is especially true hope-candle-hands11205410_swith regards to being asked, “Why?” as to why their loved one completed suicide.

Another question that can make the situation even worse is, “Why aren’t you over it yet?”

What is needed is the understanding grief is a process and journey requiring support and listening rather than statements such as, “Pull yourself up by the bootstraps.”

In terms of providing support what is better is doing the work of providing space for the survivor to process and remember what is good about the deceased individual. Communication is key. This is one of the key activities the LOSSTeam (www.lossteam.com) provides. The LOSSTeam supports the family and social structure heal and stay intact.

A large component of this is understanding and helping overcome the fear survivors feel. Support individuals can simply ask open-ended, neutral questions such as, “Tell me about your loved one,” and not comment.

How LOSSTeams work and can be called upon is explained. There is no counseling or therapeutic activity. There is just listening and pointing towards resources that can help.

Families who don’t contact LOSSTeams or similar support resources can take up to five years to reach out and ask for support. Those who had contact with the LOSSTeam reached out to resources within 39 days.

Postvention (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postvention) is defined: reaching out for support after the loved one completed suicide.

Local county health boards can be contacted to find support.

For the LOSSTeam to be effective the survivor support network needs to be in place.

Dr. Miers shares how common it is for those who are suicide survivors to have thoughts of suicide themselves, being 9 times more at risk than the general population. Thus, the importance of reaching out for support after a loved one has completed suicide.

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0014 Thrive and Connect: Suicide Survivors – LOSSTeam – Bullying: Dr. Don Belau

Dr. Don Belau (http://www.nelossteam.nebraska.edu/) shares his thoughts on two topics: his research and work on bullying and the separate topic of the history of the LOSSTeam (www.lossteam.com) conference and the benefits it provides.hope-candle-hands11205410_s

With regards to the LOSSTeam conference: it provides a forum for LOSSTeams from around the world to come together and share their work, insights, and, experience. He emphasizes how this work has helped build trust with law enforcement agencies at a local level.

Dr. Belau describes the dynamics of bullying, self-injurious behavior, their impact on at-risk-for-suicide children, and how to deal with the situation. A critical component for success is the acceptance of the at-risk child by their family. Friends and other key adults are important as well since the at-risk child may approach parents last, talking with others first.

Behavior techniques for changing behavior are explained for both the bully and victim. Included in these changes are the 3 D’s:

– Diffuse the words;
– Distract the bully’s thinking through verbal or physical techniques, and;
– Distance oneself from the bully.

Roll play and practice is encouraged.

The impact of fear and loss of control are discussed.

Schools can form support groups to practice the 3 D’s.

The impact of peer groups is discussed along with the ineffectiveness of just shaming/blaming the bully and calling their parents. Giving up on the bully can hinder improving the situation for the at-risk child. Better is teaching the bully pro-social skills, different responses, and the value of making amends.

Switching topics back to the LOSSTeams and what they can provide: support to those who survive suicide. The is especially true when those around the survivor go back to their daily routines.

The idea of having a sponsor frame-of-mind is discussed.

Dr. Belau shares the value of better training for 2 groups of people:

– Clinicians helping those with suicidal ideation as well as survivors of suicide, and;
– Those in colleges and universities training in the field of mental health.

Emphasis is placed on healing with the heart rather than only having a cognitive focus.

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0013 Thrive and Connect: Suicide Survivors – Ohio Supreme Court Justice (ret.) Evelyn Stratton

Retired Ohio Supreme Court Justice Evelyn Stratton discusses her path of increased awareness of and desire to help those with mental illness, individuals who should be in the health care system rather than prison.hope-candle-hands11205410_s

She shares her personal experience of losing a close friend who had lost his wife to suicide and in turn decided to end his own life.

The fact is mentioned that lawyers have a rate of depression three times greater than the normal population.

She also points out that suicide doesn’t always have the face of mental illness.

By helping the survivors of suicide deal with their issues the odds increase that they will become healthy and stay healthy. Her advice to those around a survivor is to be proactive. Don’t wait to be called, go ahead and contact them.

It can help to wait a few weeks after the traumatic event. It may fill a void created by those who initially help but eventually have to go back to their daily routine.

Justice Stratton points out that friends of the deceased may have their own difficulties even though not a relative. This can apply to friends at work or a cashier at the store. They should seek support as needed.

The possible ambivalence towards life and the fact an individual can go back and forth between wanting to live and wanting to die is discussed. She relates a friend who acted normal while planning his own suicide. The signs aren’t always there to observe in a clear-cut manner.

Suicide and mental difficulties among the military and how the legal system should deal with them is discussed along with the difficulties of reintegrating into daily life. She relates how her experience in this arena has shown the value of veteran courts being used to help these at-risk individuals. Specifically there are veteran justice outreach specialists available to help veterans in the criminal justice system. There are 17 such veteran courts in Ohio.

Justin Stratton discusses drug-and mental health courts and how they accept the challenge of getting the individual out of the criminal justice system through support.

7000 police officers in Ohio have been trained with regards to mental health issues. She stresses, though, that one not need wait for others to take on the responsibility. Just reach out and try to help one veteran. If you want to help you can go to the Ohio Department of Veteran Services if you want to help if you want to help whose website provides a great deal of services and resources.

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